The Future of AI-Driven Marketing: A Conversation with Sparky AI's Ted Tagalakis

Leonard Murphy, in the latest installment of the CEO series, interviews Ted Tagalakis, CEO and founder of Sparky AI. Ted shares his professional journey from sociology and advertising to founding Sparky AI, a behavioral science-based generative AI platform aimed at transforming marketing and communication processes.

Leveraging his expertise in data and NLP, Ted developed tools to streamline the creation of hyper-targeted marketing content using synthetic persona panels, which simulate audience interactions to refine messaging. This innovation reduces the time and cost traditionally required for creating marketing campaigns while maintaining precision by removing observational bias. Ted emphasizes the platform's ability to empower both large and small organizations by democratizing access to advanced tools and insights, ultimately enhancing efficiency across industries.

The discussion also delves into the broader implications of AI on workflows and organizational structures. Ted highlights how Sparky AI integrates behavioral science with data analytics to refine marketing strategies and facilitate rapid campaign creation. He reflects on the importance of staying curious, open-minded, and adaptable to evolving technologies.

As a leader, Ted dedicates time to staying informed about technological advancements and prioritizes a data-driven approach to problem-solving. The conversation concludes with insights into AI's potential to compress weeks of work into minutes, unlocking new possibilities for innovation and collaboration in the marketing and research fields.

Transcript

Leonard Murphy: Hello everybody. It's Lenny Murphy with another edition of the CEO series. I know it's been a while, but we're going to try and fix that going forward and make these more frequent. So, as we're kicking off kind of the refresh of the CEO series, I thought I would reach out to somebody who I have wanted to introduce to our listeners or audience for a long time. And that is my friend Ted Tagalakus, the CEO and founder of Sparky AI. Ted, welcome.

Ted Tagalakis: Lenny, great to be here. Thank you for having me on the show. Super excited to spend some time with my dear friend.

Leonard Murphy: I appreciate and yes, we are friends. So, audience will try not to veer into anything we have this whole tech stream that's going on all the time with all types of stuff. We won't get into any of that we'll try and just focus on business. But Ted,…

Ted Tagalakis: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Leonard Murphy: for those who don't know you, kind of tell us your origin story.

Ted Tagalakis: Lenny, a proud graduate of the University of Florida with a phenomenal degree in sociology and that took me straight into the advertising world and being in advertising for over 25 years and I actually met working on a project on an NLP project and there was always a love for data that pursued me and pushed me forward to a master's degree in data analytics. So that In advertising, for me, data is the truth and you're able to understand and bring deeper meaning to creative campaigns, to ROI for clients, and justification for investment. my natural curiosity eventually led me to start my own advertising agency. And in doing so, I realized in the age of artificial intelligence, we needed a workforce multiplier. And that being said, by understanding NLP and understanding behavioral science, I started developing with my team the Sparky AI platform.  And Sparky Aai is a behavioral science-based generative AI platform that we use we've filed two US patent applications on behavioral classification of target audiences and then using that along with our advanced writing algorithm to be able to generate content in mass at scale as a workforce multiplier for agencies and creative communications folks. But in doing so, my natural curiosity, Lenny, led me to say, if we've built these personas so deep with 30 plus different psychoraphic, behavioral design principles behind them. What would happen if we put them in a cyber room together, and had them talk?  And that's where my origin story becomes really interesting is that we are one of the few if not the leader right now in actually synthetic insights panels where we're able to synthesize and simulate conversations amongst personas to bring insights without human prejudice of observational bias in a focus doesn't replace anyone. It just sits it's a means to a first or second round of research at a pace of business, which at times is different than a pace of research. So, that's me in a nutshell. I'm a data geek. Love the love where we're at. I think that's why you and I get along so well it's about the data, and you can find truth in data.

Leonard Murphy: So you're not doing it justice I have to say.

Ted Tagalakis: And that's where in the world of advertising, marketing, the world of communications, it's how rich can your data be to bring value to the end user.

Leonard Murphy: So for listeners I've Ted and I have known each other reached out when he was developing Sparky and have been tried to be an evangelist of it from a platform standpoint. the intent here is not to get into it's not infomercial but I think what's fascinating and this is kind of indicative of where we'll get to kind of think about the future what started as a force multiplier for marketing organizations leveraging AI right to be able to create content etc etc you veered more into this researchy component of the applied behavioral science and personas from the standpoint of optimizing the marketing the messaging and the content within the platform itself, right? including everything from a blog post or an expost or a Facebook post the imagery etc etc is all through this lens of kind of real time testing and optimization via the synthetic panel with these personas to optimize the marketing messaging. did I explain that accurately?

Ted Tagalakis: You really did, Lenny. the challenge, when I was looking at the frontier models and the outputs that were coming, we all have wonderful engineers. Every AI company has phenomenal engineers, but the content was coming out to a degree that was flat. And the reason it was coming out flat because it was not the models and I hope this doesn't come off corny but we weren't giving them a stole to write from.

Leonard Murphy: Mhm.

Ted Tagalakis: We weren't giving them how a person would understand a topic and from that understanding of a topic how they should write to hit a subconscious emotional level, one versus system two,  And when you direct properly the black box to write, it's beautiful. And the other thing from the NLP stand it's understanding how humans write is understanding that you have to look at a corpus of work to understand pacing and diction and visualizations and a myriad of things. when we do a writing sample analysis we're looking at over 30 different items to understand how you write. and I love to give my PR folks a hard time. We go down to the Oxford comma. people don't like the Oxford comma. The rest of the world loves the Oxford comma. I'm a proponent of the Oxford. So, that being said, we look to all of that, to understand how a Lenny would write. but that once again, you have to look at data to understand that. You have to take the marketing side of it and then bring in the data side of it to say hey look this is how we can have a richer output and the only way you do that is by understanding and analyzing content and we looked at 200,000 pieces of human writing to come up with how people write the average writing style and then understanding how to go in and once I don't want this to sound like an infomercial…

Leonard Murphy: Yep. Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: But this is just going to the data side of things going into understanding  How can you then at scale replicate that? And that's where to me the fascination of what we can do today versus what we could do 12 months ago versus what we could do 15 years ago when you and I first met. night and day. And it's exciting.  And that's where understanding having a research background where we can go in and say, "Hey, we need to look at the problem from a communications marketing standpoint, but also from a research standpoint. where does the data lead us? Let's not look at the shiny object. Let's look at the data. Let's understand data. Let's get from that point to how we then can start replicating at scale. And that's what we did with Sparkies, we, looked at, a horizont a longitudinal study of psychological and behavioral science studies to come up with the 10 behavioral sparks that we classify people in.  And then it's in order to understand how a human can act without bringing in situational bias. What motivates them? What are the psychological principles that will motivate somebody? Then distilling that and then being able to pipe people into that is phenomenal. And then now the new thing where and a little preview this is coming out by end of year by the way is 2024 in case someone from the future is watching. we're able with the new set of persona development that we'll launch by year end is make attitudinal adjustments where you'll on a scale of one to five rank the persona in a couple in elements and it'll take a neutally attitudinal person and then say okay this is a Debbie Downer or this is a Susie Sunshine or…

Leonard Murphy: Mhm.

Ted Tagalakis: And  now because that behavioral profile is different than a neutral behavioral profile, Then we have some other really cool stuff that I'll tell you later offline, but it's just really neat because you then can take these simulated individuals and put them in a room to work through product messaging, to work through ideiation. we have several different types of panels that we've created. one if you have a product and you want to come up with a campaign and how you can message a group of people that have different profiles on a group behavioral profile. So that way you can hit the masses as opposed to just a Lenny or just a 10,  So that's what's really exciting about what we can do with large language models and the analyses that can be done at scale.

Leonard Murphy: Yep. It's crazy.

Ted Tagalakis: Something that persona development Lenny as would take us in the good old days we'll call them now weeks plus to develop now with as much accuracy as we had in the manual manner we now can create personas in 60 seconds that are as accurate as a manual persona creation it's nuts. And that's what to me is as a futurist, it's exciting to see is what have we done? I mean, this is like being in a kid in a candy store now with artificial intelligence and as much data as we can get, and the synthetic there's research studies that have come out now that are backing the accuracy of synthetic behavioral studies versus traditional human studies because they're removing observational bias.  Yeah. And when you can remove a bias, you can get to the crux of the challenge. And thats what's super exciting the innovation you can do with our ethos panel…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: where it's just here's an idea here's a topic come up with a product or it's neat and it's fascinating because you can do that in 90 seconds as opposed to nine months it's an end product but it leapfrogs the process and that's where our inov innovations now can start coming out rapidly and it's just super exciting.

Leonard Murphy: So that's a good segue as we kind of think about the future, the way I think about this general topic,…

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah. Right.

Leonard Murphy: we can get into the weeds on the specific coolness aspects, But effectively AI is unlock for workflow efficiency at kind of its purest form. It just makes things that would take hours and hours or days and days faster. and assuming that the underlying data is good and in garbage out still applies. yeah but that idea of creating workflow efficiencies and particularly from a data standpoint that's driving decision- making and development across the board. what you have built is specifically aligned currently to marketing optimization to that content creation marketing workflow but I can easily see and I imagine you're thinking the same thing all right what do we take what is the sparky solely focused on on product innovation what does that look like…

Ted Tagalakis: Wait, one sound. I hope so. Absolutely.

Leonard Murphy: What is the sparky that is solely focused on user experience optimization, right? What does that look like? And eventually we got one big sparky type hopefully it is sparky, but a platform that is leveraging existing data and I envision that there's a new flow of new data coming in all the time as as people do change, maybe not fundamentally, but perceptions, tastes, those things. So we're not replacing the need for research. there's still going to be a need for primary research. It just may occur at different stages than it does today. but fundamentally it's all going into a system that looks like Sparky that we are leveraging to reduce the workflow from weeks to hours or even minutes. Is that kind of your vision of how

Ted Tagalakis: Absolutely, Lenny. I mean, you nailed it on the head. I mean, we're able to do analyses now at scale and faster than humanly possible before. when you're looking at ideiating, whether it's a creative campaign or product innovation, you're looking like we'll run a synthetic panel in less than 90 seconds with full transcripts and analyses of which persona influenced which persona shifted. there's some other nifty stuff that we're adding into it with NPS and things like that. But what you're able to do at scale immediately without infusing too much additional data is understanding on a basis this is where the world lies. You come up with that idea or You take one of the four ideas. You blow out the campaign. Now you've done a full campaign in less than a week. you can do a full campaign I would say in an hour. then you put it live and now the next global we have coming and this is coming for those of you in the future so if you're watching this mid 2025 is probably being launched. It's a full feedback loop where we'll bring in all your digital analytics or your shopper analytics. And what we're able at that point to do and we do have a team working on this right now is we're able to then look at the creative that was out in the market. Was there a lift?  and you're looking at this being done instantaneously and then you're able to optimize creative as the week is happening. as a proponent of digital media and especially digital paid media, you have to allow algorithms to work for a week or two. But if you're taking that lag into account and you see, has increased, is flat, adset C is decreasing, why is it decreasing? Is it your targeting in your paid media campaigns? If it's not the targeting, if the targeting is all the same, you're just, ABC testing, then okay, why is it not resonating?  You then can go in and optimize the creative based on the best performing ad literally in minutes. Relaunch the campaign. And then additionally you can look at your media channels that your investment in is in because media consumption changes daily weekly and…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: Do a and remodel your media and change your investment based on increasing your ROI on the highest performing media mix.  So you're talking about processes that would take departments and tons of time now being compressed because of the way we can process data in minutes. So that's the future I'm envisioning and then if you really want to get crazy if you can take wearable technology and bring that data you can do some cool stuff but staying away from the wearables this is where you can literally understand your audience understand your market and…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: Understand without making grave creative mistakes the pulse of your  business. And that to me is what's exciting because not just letting can large entities do this, but you're talking about democratizing and empowering small to midsize companies to do this. look at the Fortune 500s. media companies have departments that do the media mix model. really smart people.  Now we can empower those people to be smarter, but also the smaller companies that can't afford, a WPP an Omnicom, they can now have that same power. That is the beauty of where we're going is we can bring insights and democratize those insights to the mom and…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: pops, and that's powerful and that to me is what's awesome about where we are and more importantly where we're going as an industry, not just in the marketing side, but in the data side, and that's truly what's just super exciting to me about where we're at. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: And the walls come down, I mean, today we have these silos. there's research and there's lots of subcategories of research UX CX yada competitive intelligence blah blah blah all sitting underneath marketing and there's analytics over here and now we're creating the technologies that removes those silos and allows them to integrate what will that do to organizational structure it's going to be really really interesting to watch that I want to be conscious of your time and as well as the audience so housekeeping audience. I'm trying to keep these to about 30 minutes. If we go to 35 or 40, I'm sorry, but we're going to try. So, obviously you've had a career up to this point, and that's shaped you.

Leonard Murphy: Any key lessons that you've learned in your career that helped get you to where you are now that

Ted Tagalakis: God. Yeah, and the most important one is stay curious, stay open-minded and be curious and never take no for an answer. when I started developing Sparky my core group of engineers were like that can't be done and the reason they said it can't be done because no one's done no one did it and I was like no it can be done and it's not it's avoiding those shutdown opportunities and that to me it's be a sponge be curious question it can't be done and be committed to a vision, and that's what I think why we became friends is we're both curious, and we love data. We're curious. We wanted to do better things. And that's when I started Sparky, when I started my agency, it's because I wanted to do better. I didn't take no for an answer. And with Sparky, I was like, what? We're going to blow the doors off because what people said can't be done, I'm going to do. I think six months ago you and I had a conversation about the synthetic insights panels and you're like that's long long away it's far away and I'm like Lenny it's like it's coming on Monday and the conversation we have is Saturday. but that honestly the thing is stay curious and be a sponge and don't take no for an answer. That's been my motto. It's been my philosophy. and also the other thing is listen. And God rest my father's soul, but as a kid, he told me, you can be dead set on what you believe in, but always listen to everybody else.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: They'll either prove you right or they'll show you something that you didn't realize. And that's where I think as a society have stopped listening to other people. And we haven't taken that need to open up and listen and take in opposing views because some of the stuff that we're doing now there are a couple things that we've added that just I wasn't thinking but because I had a conversation with someone they're like hey did you think of this I'm like hadn't but let me see what we can do and we didn't execute on that but that opened the door to something else and that what's great

Leonard Murphy: So the question I intended to wrap up with although I think we may have already gotten there was advice for the next generation of leaders and actually I think it is still relevant. So everything that you just said and thinking about the future, let's put a different spin on it. as you think about your challenges as a leader in this evolving future, what do you think those are? How are you going to have to adapt and how do all of us need to adapt to this world where we have force multipliers of technology, we have simplified workflows, we're also unlocking hopefully more value creation across the board. how are you preparing yourself as a leader for that in the last week?

Ted Tagalakis: it's a great question because right, this is what our fourth technological evolution we're going through, Lenny. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: I'll spare the audience, but, the computer leaving from the typewriter, non, …

Leonard Murphy: Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: We're innovating now at record speed.  And every business leader's challenge right now is trying to stay up todate with that speed, what is the new thing that's coming out? are there new methodologies? is there something new that's coming?  And for me, what I have to do is I have to set aside an hour every day. and sometimes my wife hates me for this because it's at the end of the night and I'm on the couch. I'm sitting down and I'm reading and I'm reading research papers. I'm reading, where, thought leaders to see what could potentially be coming out, and I'm having an open mind and I'm not foundationally driven where this is I have planted a flag in the ground, but I know I can build around that flag. it's not just a one by one and it's like how does the new tech that's coming out, how can that impact our business?  What new tech do we need for our business? How can we grow our business? And looking at it from a future standpoint of yeah, this is how things are done now, but being told this is how we've always done it. It's never the answer. how can we do it better. for us inside the platform before the synthetic insights panels came out, it's like, okay, let's build a persona, let's create a creative brief, and then let's build the tools. Okay a process that would take two to three weeks plus in an agency, we can knock out, build a persona, do a creative brief, and do a full campaign for social with blogs, b blah blah blah in five minutes. Okay, the synthetic insights run the panel, do all that. Now, which is coming soon, to a Sparky near you, actually create the campaign after the panel.  You can do that whole thing now in under five minutes. So what else do we need to do? What other workflow can we bring an efficiency to? That's for future what we need to look for and we need to say try to stay one step ahead. But the only way we're going to do that is by opening our minds reading the research papers that are coming out trying to understand where people are going with the tech. What breakthroughs could happen. Look, we're December of 2024.

Leonard Murphy: My sense as well.

Ted Tagalakis: I will tell you it AGI probably is from what I understand most likely here, just not released. I think I firmly because I just know what we can do and I know I'm just confident it's there. I'm looking at ASI, artificial super intelligence. does that come in 2025, 2026, or 2027? and it's preparing yourself, understanding the tech, not being a lagard. You don't have to be the innovator, but be an early adopter or early majority at the latest to understand how you can implement the technology into your ethos so you don't get left behind…

Leonard Murphy: Yep. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: Because I can tell you this, what we can do today, what we did 12 months ago are polar opposites, night and day. And I mean, just this week there were some odd models released yesterday, and that was 20 more than the 10 before the day before. So, we have to open our minds, think of where things can go. Look for areas that can be improved but can be improved. Don't throw AI out there if something can be done on an Excel spreadsheet. that's not the use. how can we improve and better improve lives, workflows, but more importantly, understand the tech? And that's the thing that you get, many leaders get is understanding what the technology can do and then trying to envision…

Leonard Murphy: No.

Ted Tagalakis: How it can make you better. So, I hope that wasn't too long for you or for the audience, but that it's an exciting time and it's one of these things where we can do so We can do so much better for our people. I was speaking with an agency yesterday, in walking through what we do on the platform. once again, not an infomercial, but we were able to show…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: You take two weeks worth of time and you compress it now to minutes. And it's like, now our people can go do other things, and that's the thing that people should not be afraid of. And that's the other thing I should mention is get rid of the  Embrace the fear because the only it's not going to replace you. It's going to enhance you the moment you get over that aspect and make that mental shift and understand how to use the tech as opposed to being afraid of the tech. you're going to set your mind right and you're going to open up possibilities that you never thought existed.

Leonard Murphy: There's an hourly rate for my time, etc. And I don't pad that, but the process was to take what's in my brain and get it out. And there's just a process that I used to do that. And that's how I, feed my family.

Ted Tagalakis: Right. Right.

Leonard Murphy: And I was concerned personally on, you obviously, which is always weird. It's like, I see all this, but I'm not doing it yet. until finally, there was a project and I was pushed for time that I needed to get done and thought, I'm going to, let's see what I can do with chat GPT to streamline some specific things that were not value ad, it was like some I needed to compile some information that if I was going and searching for it, it would have taken me two hours, right?  And instead I was, " holy crap. I got this in five minutes." and That was that getting over component for me to realize look, there's grunt work that is not value ad and…

Ted Tagalakis: Right. Right.

Leonard Murphy: This is not replacing me because people aren't paying me for the grunt work. The grunt work is necessary to get to the product. So, …

Ted Tagalakis: But Lenny on the grunt work side of it, if you did not have the subject matter expertise that you have,…

Leonard Murphy: Right.

Ted Tagalakis: The end result that would have come out from Claude, from anyone would not have been at the level that she brought out.

Leonard Murphy: I had to write the right prompts and go back and forth and it's iterative process. Yes. So I share with the audience of I agree with that 100% and…

Ted Tagalakis: Yep.

Leonard Murphy: And also reiterate the stain of breast. Make time to read. none of this TLDDR crap, you can summarize that's okay, There are things that I summarize. but You need to listen. if it's a podcast, whatever, but absorb this content. Stay connected. it gets the juices flowing. It's just necessary to do that. even if it's laying in bed you, I'm laying in bed, my wife, put your phone down like I honey, there's this thing I wanted to read earlier and I didn't get a chance to. I got to read it now. Even though two seconds later I'm snoring, but

Ted Tagalakis: It's funny because before the last two years I was the most undigital digital person and was never on my phone was ever, whatever. my wife now is saying, "You're always on social media." I'm like, "I'm not on social media. I'm reading on this. I'm reading on that." and she's like, "Oh." She goes, "But you're still on social media." I'm like, " Medium's not These research papers I'm reading are not social media. I may get a link off of Twitter to go read, but what are we whatever we're call Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Just sent me this link on text. So, yeah, I'm not actually looking at that, but yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah, I'm on Uncle Elon's platform. Let me take a look. but you have to constantly read. You have to stay a breast of what's happening.  And to your point, look, the TLDDRs, you cannot un sound bites don't work, and there's a lot of times that you get into a meeting with someone and they'll ask a question and, it's the landmine that they're anticipating a sound bite because that's what came out on the newsletter this morning. you have to get in deeper. You have to understand it.

Leonard Murphy: All right. Yes.

Ted Tagalakis: And the moment you can start understanding that, that's what opens the brain. That's what opens the pathway to enlightenment, to be able to expand your business,…

Leonard Murphy: Yes. Yeah,…

Ted Tagalakis: To expand your workflows, just to enrich you and it's great. I said this I guess at the last ical revolution. We live in the best technological revolution now. And it's just awesome, So it really is like …

Leonard Murphy: It is. I couldn't agree more that contextualization is what enables the dot connecting, And it's just like the way we are wired. the synaps is firing, neurons connecting it. That's what the information flow does, which is probably what's going to generate the super intelligence is, a very similar process. But anyway, you and I can go on and on. …

Ted Tagalakis: Absolutely. …

Leonard Murphy: Ted, where can people find you?

Ted Tagalakis: Lenny, so multiple easy ways. I'm on Ted Tagalakis on LinkedIn. you can go to rk fill out the contact form there. It always gets to me. Or you can email me at tedsparky.ai. that's that three easy ways. Pick your poison. or you can come to Atlanta and we're based out of Atlanta Tech Village in January when they open up the Atlanta Tech Village South Downtown, we're going to be one of the first tenants down there as well. So always look forward to people just popping in the office as well. We always have time.

Leonard Murphy: After the holidays. So maybe we'd can be one of the first guests down there.

Ted Tagalakis: We'd love to have you, buddy.

Leonard Murphy: All glad to have you as the inaugural guest of the relaunch of the CEO series. this will be going out live pretty soon. and audience, thank you so much. Appreciate I mean obviously Ted and I chat all the time, but not like this. So, thank you for giving us the opportunity to kind of focus our conversation in something that hopefully was impactful and meaningful for you as well. So, that's it for this edition of the CEO series. Everyone, be as Ted said, we're recording this in December of 2024. So, happy holidays as well. And, we'll talk soon everybody. Take care.

Ted Tagalakis: We're gonna get to that.

Leonard Murphy: All right. Little awkward stop the recording thing there, but all right. That's what editing is for. Dude, you're such a natural at this. I mean, you should do more video content yourself. sure.

Ted Tagalakis: I just Lenny, I started the podcast and there was so much to do and with the company that I didn't have the time. Now when we moved to South Downtown, we have two private offices inside our big office. so we'll be able to do a scheduled podcast there. And we executed our first enterprise agreement. We've started dev number two is along the way. and then I owe Allison over at Walmart a deck. She's going to get that tomorrow. I just coincidentally that great research paper came out on the synthetic stuff because the only question I had from our mutual buddy was how does this help innovation? What I'm gonna do here here the opening of the synthetic panels. We're going to talk about it. Here's the quote. This is how it helps. Yeah. we are having in so I have figured out an NPS shifting algorithm.

Leonard Murphy: Okay. I mean, Lord knows NPS needs help being in a thousand ways, so anything. Yeah. Okay.

Ted Tagalakis: So if we know the NPS scores, we can run a synthetic panel. So the next panel that's coming out is an NPS shifter. So we go in and we have them talk and then we identifying the underlying issues of basically where they're at and…

Leonard Murphy: Right. Right.

Ted Tagalakis: We come up campaign that's behavioral science-based to shift the NPS.

Leonard Murphy: That Yeah.

Ted Tagalakis: Stay curious, my friend.

Leonard Murphy: The most interesting man in the world, Ted Techus, the boy. You need to talk to Medallion or Qualrix. Okay.

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah, that's Yeah, that's gold right there. And then I have another one where we have a bad apple in the room to see how the bad apple influences

Leonard Murphy: That the All right. Did you b that off of me?

Ted Tagalakis: I modeled after me.

Leonard Murphy: All right. I've got another call in a few minutes and I got to get these dogs situated before that one as well.

Ted Tagalakis: Thanks, buddy.

Leonard Murphy: So no,…

Ted Tagalakis: It's really humbled. Thank you for having me,

Leonard Murphy: Thank you.

Ted Tagalakis: I love it. we'll have to get together and the new one won't be ready for call it two weeks. but we're actually doing a redesign of the UEIE inside making it sleeker. there's some new stuff. we're doing The new creative brief that's coming out real quick. you got to go the new creative brief is multi-persona…

Leonard Murphy: All right.

Ted Tagalakis: And that came about because of the innovation of the inside panel on how I can come up with a behavioral spark that works for the group. Same concept for this.

Leonard Murphy: Neat. How can you synthesize it? So, you're hitting multiple targets at once rather than Okay,…

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: That makes sense. Can't wait to see it.

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah. Awesome.

Leonard Murphy: All right. the …

Ted Tagalakis: And when I go to South by Southwest in Austin, I'd love to meet Joe Rogan.

Leonard Murphy: If I am I have a connection to Joe Rogan.

Ted Tagalakis: We know people.

Leonard Murphy: I am not connected to Joe Rogan…

Ted Tagalakis: I know you connection too.

Leonard Murphy: But I'm right there with you.

Ted Tagalakis: I'm dropping that there.

Leonard Murphy: So, I think we owe Rogan and Elon much gratitude. So they I think timeline shifted that in truly I think that happened.

Ted Tagalakis: Yeah. It was a lifting shot.

Leonard Murphy: I think we were on one course and then we shifted. So yeah, absolutely. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: It wasn't even a beer. It was like changing tracks.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yeah. I mean there's probably Mandela effect s*** if we could go back and look like this changed right then. So it's a whole different thing. So all right, buddy. You take care. All right.

Ted Tagalakis: You too.

Ted Tagalakis: I appreciate it.

Leonard Murphy: Bye. Yep.

Ted Tagalakis: Thanks a lot.